Intel Core Ultra 9 285K & Ultra 5 245K CPU Review

[Grimlakin]

While true, we also likely don't all have a full handle on every facet of the hobby, right?

And we also have to refresh our knowledge every few years if we don't have time to stay on top of everything...

100% true. But for me, and I presume for many, this is both a profession and a hobby. So for work I get the do engineering and develop server solutions, manage VMware (Maybe RHEL Hypervisors in the near future), and Illumio, and SAN storage running on dedicated fabric networks... SQL server tuning... all of that fun stuff. And at home I get to play games and use a lot of the tech that is ultimately derivative from what I have in the office.

 

[markfw]

As a new member here, I have to ask, why does this review only have 2 Intel processors compared ? Many places to like 5 of Intel and 5 of AMD so you can get an idea of what you might buy.

 

[David_Schroth]

As a new member here, I have to ask, why does this review only have 2 Intel processors compared ? Many places to like 5 of Intel and 5 of AMD so you can get an idea of what you might buy.

This was our launch day article - the only two chips that Intel sampled widely were the 285K and 245K. Anyone getting chips for review only got those two. We also procured a 265K that we covered subsequently - but since the Z890 platform was also brand new, we had to cover a board at launch time as well. If I'm remembering right, we also got about 3 significant BIOS revs in the week leading up to the publication date along with some pretty odd performance results that we went back and forth with Intel on.

To be frank on the traffic side of things, we do a lot more pageviews/SEO rank on gaming/GPU and motherboard reviews than we do with CPU reviews, so we usually just hit them once and don't revisit. CPU testing results can also be very touchy to BIOS revs, Windows versions, configuration making them pretty difficult to compare across even our reviews - so if we do haul out CPUs to test, we're also pulling in fresh comparison data at the same time. CPU testing also requires a fresh windows install for any CPU swap to ensure consistent performance....

That being said, the product comparison and graphing engine that is being built should allow us to easily display more detailed data and call out where the underlying system may have differed and let the readers sort it out - it's a big undertaking, but hopefully coming soon-ish.

Ninja Edit: Actually seems we have not reviewed the 265K - which means we never got one sampled to us. There were back to back product launches flying all over the place when Arrow Lake launched, so by the time we took a breath to consider it, it seemed a bit late in the lifecycle....

 

[DAPUNISHER]

This was Intel's Bulldozer moment where the retail/DIY space is concerned. I don't agree with the arguments for buying it for productivity either. Whatever advantage it has over Zen 5 in the same price range is debuffed by the lack of appreciable upgrade path. The rumor mill is already claiming Zen 7 will be on AM5. If there is any legitimacy to the claim, AM5 is by far the best investment, just as AM4 proved to be.

Sure, you could get better gaming performance than Zen by buying the 8700K that Intel rushed out before the year was over. The massive problem is how short lived that advantage was. I've also run a 2600, 3600, 5800X, and 5800X3D with the very same X370 system I originally built with a 1500X in 2017. Meanwhile, Intel changed platforms more often than a hobo changes underwear.

Arrow Lake not being made in Intel's own fabs is the cherry on top of the Sundae. Is Arrow Lake a bad CPU? No. But there is no compelling reason to choose it over AM5.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Ninja Edit: Actually seems we have not reviewed the 265K - which means we never got one sampled to us. There were back to back product launches flying all over the place when Arrow Lake launched, so by the time we took a breath to consider it, it seemed a bit late in the lifecycle....

It's a shame because, of all the Z890 CPUs, the 265k is probably the one that makes the most sense at its pricepoint.

Is Arrow Lake a bad CPU? No. But there is no compelling reason to choose it over AM5.

It kind of is a bad CPU for desktop since it has roots in Meteor Lake that really hold it back.

 

[screwtch02]

Have zero issues with my 265KF. Currently running 5700 Perf core, 5000 Eff core. Was solid upgrade over my X299 setup for sure.

 

[Tyler-98-W68]

I'm not sure how some people can say arrow lake is a Bulldozer moment.

It is competitive performance wise, it's very efficient (especially compared to last Gen)

I also don't understand the dead platform argument.

AM4 was an anomaly and I don't see that being the norm.

As an example. If I built a 285K system today I'm not likely to upgrade for a few years. If I needed to upgrade changing motherboards (sockets) really isn't a big deal to me. Yeah I get the whole 5800x3d was the cream of the crop AM4 cpu if you were upgrading from early zen, but lets be real enthusiasts are in the minority when it comes to the overall picture, not everyone is buying a computer with the expectation they can upgrade the CPU.

It kind of is a bad CPU for desktop since it has roots in Meteor Lake that really hold it back.

More proof of "bad cpu" ? Since Meteor lake never touched the desktop it's pretty hard to compare laptop to desktop CPUs.

Yes there was some performance regression in some cases, but massive steps forward in efficiency, and there was a noticeable increase in single thread performance with arrow lake. Because it's loosely based on meteor lake doesn't mean it's bad. The E-Core on Arrow lake are on the same level of performance as the Alder lake (12th gen P-Cores) so they managed to get 8P cores and 16E Cores into something that doesn't need to go over 300w, let alone the stock 250w power limit.

I came from both 7800X3D and 14900K systems to 9800X3D and 285K systems, biggest difference, I lost zero performance going to a 285K (in fact gained) and my power consumption dropped a lot.

I don't game at 1080p either with my 5090, so when playing games at 4k I can't tell the difference between a 285K and 9800X3D, there is only 1 game that I play where there was a large tangible difference between the 285K and 9800X3D at 4k (Derail valley) in the order of 50-60fps better, however a CPU getting 140fps vs 200fps isn't something I consider "unplayable" on the 140fps system. But I also do more than game so having more cores is beneficial in my situation.

I also have a Core Ultra 5 225 system (low end arrow lake CPU) and the funny thing is once again gaming at 4K, I can't really tell the difference between it and a 285K or a 9800X3D.

No denying the 9800X3D is the best gaming CPU, but all this talk about how terrible Arrow Lake is, is simply unfounded and it's mostly people who have no experience using it either.

Using pricing as an example. (Canadian)

A 9800X3D is $640

A 265K is $400

RTX 5070 is $800

A RTX 5070Ti is $1100

If one was on a pretty tight budget,

The $260 dollars saved getting a 265K would mean spending $40 more would get you a 5070Ti instead of a 5070.

I would much rather have a 5070Ti and 265K than a 9800X3D with a weaker 5070 is I was spending the same amount of money.

Same thing 5070Ti to 5080, that $260 could be used to save on a CPU and get a better GPU.

Just because intel priced AL like garbage when it came out, doesn't mean it's still garbage when they reduce the prices a lot.

AMD used to seriously value price their CPU's but that didn't make them bad back then did it?

TLDR Arrow Lake isn't as bad as what people think.

 

[Grimlakin]

I'm not sure how some people can say arrow lake is a Bulldozer moment.

It is competitive performance wise, it's very efficient (especially compared to last Gen)

I also don't understand the dead platform argument.

AM4 was an anomaly and I don't see that being the norm.

As an example. If I built a 285K system today I'm not likely to upgrade for a few years. If I needed to upgrade changing motherboards (sockets) really isn't a big deal to me. Yeah I get the whole 5800x3d was the cream of the crop AM4 cpu if you were upgrading from early zen, but lets be real enthusiasts are in the minority when it comes to the overall picture, not everyone is buying a computer with the expectation they can upgrade the CPU.



More proof of "bad cpu" ? Since Meteor lake never touched the desktop it's pretty hard to compare laptop to desktop CPUs.

Yes there was some performance regression in some cases, but massive steps forward in efficiency, and there was a noticeable increase in single thread performance with arrow lake. Because it's loosely based on meteor lake doesn't mean it's bad. The E-Core on Arrow lake are on the same level of performance as the Alder lake (12th gen P-Cores) so they managed to get 8P cores and 16E Cores into something that doesn't need to go over 300w, let alone the stock 250w power limit.

I came from both 7800X3D and 14900K systems to 9800X3D and 285K systems, biggest difference, I lost zero performance going to a 285K (in fact gained) and my power consumption dropped a lot.

I don't game at 1080p either with my 5090, so when playing games at 4k I can't tell the difference between a 285K and 9800X3D, there is only 1 game that I play where there was a large tangible difference between the 285K and 9800X3D at 4k (Derail valley) in the order of 50-60fps better, however a CPU getting 140fps vs 200fps isn't something I consider "unplayable" on the 140fps system. But I also do more than game so having more cores is beneficial in my situation.

I also have a Core Ultra 5 225 system (low end arrow lake CPU) and the funny thing is once again gaming at 4K, I can't really tell the difference between it and a 285K or a 9800X3D.

No denying the 9800X3D is the best gaming CPU, but all this talk about how terrible Arrow Lake is, is simply unfounded and it's mostly people who have no experience using it either.

Using pricing as an example. (Canadian)

A 9800X3D is $640

A 265K is $400

RTX 5070 is $800

A RTX 5070Ti is $1100

If one was on a pretty tight budget,

The $260 dollars saved getting a 265K would mean spending $40 more would get you a 5070Ti instead of a 5070.

I would much rather have a 5070Ti and 265K than a 9800X3D with a weaker 5070 is I was spending the same amount of money.

Same thing 5070Ti to 5080, that $260 could be used to save on a CPU and get a better GPU.

Just because intel priced AL like garbage when it came out, doesn't mean it's still garbage when they reduce the prices a lot.

AMD used to seriously value price their CPU's but that didn't make them bad back then did it?

TLDR Arrow Lake isn't as bad as what people think.

Are you paid to be here, or is your first post a defense of Intel just a coincidence? Either way I personally want Intel to pull through. Competition is the best. But I will buy whatever CPU meets my need the best for the price I am willing to pay when I am willing to pay it. Same for the systems I Architect for the company I work for. When it's time we will strongly consider EPYC or whatever the current is but for those we are more interested in longevity and stability than core count. And as the saying go's, nobody ever got fired for using Intel CPU's.

 

[Tyler-98-W68]

No I'm not paid to be here, what should my first post be then? Guess you missed the part about having AMD systems too?

Sad state most kids are online these days. Anyone speaking about intel not in a bad light is a paid intel shill.......guess it's just delusional amd fan boys all around. Thanks for reminding me why I mostly avoid forums these days.

 

[David_Schroth]

Are you paid to be here, or is your first post a defense of Intel just a coincidence? Either way I personally want Intel to pull through. Competition is the best. But I will buy whatever CPU meets my need the best for the price I am willing to pay when I am willing to pay it. Same for the systems I Architect for the company I work for. When it's time we will strongly consider EPYC or whatever the current is but for those we are more interested in longevity and stability than core count. And as the saying go's, nobody ever got fired for using Intel CPU's.

I don't think it's a full defense of Intel - it's reality of the current pricing environment. The Canadian pricing is a bit off of ours here in the US - but if you're looking at where to spend the next set of incremental dollars to improve your gaming experience, the GPU is where to go, especially if you're at the 5070 level.

Of course, the 9700X could be dropped in as the AMD choice of where to save money instead of the 265K, but it is an Intel chip review here....

 

[Grimlakin]

No I'm not paid to be here, what should my first post be then? Guess you missed the part about having AMD systems too?

Sad state most kids are online these days. Anyone speaking about intel not in a bad light is a paid intel shill.......guess it's just delusional amd fan boys all around. Thanks for reminding me why I mostly avoid forums these days.

Ok just seemed like an oddly verbose post for a first post. With gorilla marketing being what it is I had to ask. Glad you're not of course.

 

[Tyler-98-W68]

9700X is $440 in Canada, so it's close in performance/price. Application wise (overall) the 265K is about 17% faster, gaming performance is identical basically.

Positives on both sides. One could argue go with the Intel chip 20 cores 20 threads, and be somewhat future proofed not having to upgrade the cpu (but a "dead" platform as some have it) or go with the 9700X on AM5 and then in the future upgrade to a chip with more cores if a use case requires it. But then the "dead intel platform" argument is somewhat less of a reality because now instead of buying a new motherboard and cpu, If you had AM5 and the 9700X you would be buying another CPU (so 2 cpu's and 1 motherboard) vs just buying 1 motherboard and 1 CPU and not needing to upgrade for a while longer.

 

[Grimlakin]

I've had the AM4 platform and went from a 3900x to a 5900x but bought new motherboard with it as well. basically whole system... I'm not really concerned having to replace it all when I upgrade... but that's just me I suppose.

 

[LazyGamer]

TLDR Arrow Lake isn't as bad as what people think.

The main issue is the increase in memory latency from Raptor Lake, without an increase in cache to deal with it. This directly impacts frametimes, which determine how games feel.

Now, I realize that you said that you can't tell the difference, so just keep in mind: while you're not alone, you're also a sample of one. Frametime analysis and the subsequent 1.0% and 0.1% low measures used in reviews are a result of decades of 'average framerates' not matching up with how games 'felt'. A lot of people get behind these newer measurements because they more accurately describe their experience.

And that's where Arrow Lake mostly falls short. Gaming.

Everywhere else, it's a better, faster, more efficient, better overall platform for power users.

 

[Tyler-98-W68]

I don't think I've ever heard of someone complaining about microstuttering on an arrow lake platform, yet it's prevalent on the X3D chips. As for frametimes and 1 and 0.1% lows i don't recall anyone ever complaining about arrow lake feeling laggy, in fact arrow lake has competitive 1% and 0.1% lows, absolutely it's average framerate is lower but the 1 and 0.1% lows are not as great of a difference as the average framerate vs X3d chips.

 

[LazyGamer]

I don't think I've ever heard of someone complaining about microstuttering on an arrow lake platform, yet it's prevalent on the X3D chips. As for frametimes and 1 and 0.1% lows i don't recall anyone ever complaining about arrow lake feeling laggy, in fact arrow lake has competitive 1% and 0.1% lows, absolutely it's average framerate is lower but the 1 and 0.1% lows are not as great of a difference as the average framerate vs X3d chips.

Please return when you've completed more research, thanks!

 

[DAPUNISHER]

No I'm not paid to be here, what should my first post be then? Guess you missed the part about having AMD systems too?

This is the exact excuse used by the worst paid shill of the early 21st century - Brian Smith AKA Rollo in the Anandtech forums. Nvidia even leaned on Anand to bring him and his douchebag friend back after they were banned. They just had to have "Nvidia Focus Group Member" in their sig. They even bribed Anand to make one of them a moderator. That's the only time I have ever seen Anand lose so much street cred with the community. What a joke. I lost some respect for him too. Money should never come before consumer advocacy. You have to pick a side. Gamers Nexus is the prime example of dong that.

How can I be biased if I own the competition's hardware? He'd claim. Meanwhile he was paid to post the entire time. And had the standard "snake oil did wonders for me" plant in the crowd, to back him up. All so he could do a dishonest compare and contrast. Weak.

Sad state most kids are online these days.

Some of us have been around a long, long, time. And we have lived through the Nvidia and Intel guerilla marketing, gaslighting, and astroturfing + Anti consumer and Anti competitive practices. Never again. I nuke that crap from orbit in the forums I police. We insist on honest and open dialogue, free of advertising, misinformation, and disinformation. Along with a higher level of decorum than allowing lazy labels like
"fanboy". I've probably banned you at least once already.

Anyone speaking about intel not in a bad light is a paid intel shill.......guess it's just delusional amd fanboys all around. Thanks for reminding me why I mostly avoid forums these days.

The only delusional people, are the arrow lake acolytes trying to pimp a dead on arrival platform with CPUs that are worse for gaming( You know, the thing that drives retail sales/DIY) Than the generation that came before it.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Please return when you've completed more research, thanks!

AMDip is the worst copium huffing talking point this decade.

 

[Tyler-98-W68]

I bet I've been around as long if not longer than to, building systems from the 486 days. But again this just proves my point even more. Good thing you cant nuke me, I'll see myself out as this place is no different from everywhere else. Delusional amd fanboys and people like you thinking they are all high and mighty "policing" things.

 

[Tyler-98-W68]

Also please tell me where im paid to post anything. What a bunch of horseshit, that's about as likely as you thinking you are someone important. I'm an independent person who simply buys hardware and tests it out on games I play. I have zero sponsors, receive zero money. Feel free to check out my extensive BeamNG testing on both amd and intel systems.....but again you can go away with accusing me of being paid.