HDMI 2.1 Receivers Can’t Pass 4K/120 Hz Content from NVIDIA GeForce RTX 30 Series GPUs and Xbox Series X Due to Major Chipset Bug

[Tsing]

Image: Denon



If you’re thinking of spending big bucks on a shiny, new HDMI 2.1-compatible receiver, forget about it. Following a report from German publication Heise, at least two manufacturers have confirmed that newer receivers are crippled by a major Panasonic chipset bug that prevents proper pass-through of high bit-rate content (e.g., 4K/120 Hz, 8K/60 Hz) with certain devices.



Some of the victims reportedly include NVIDIA’s GeForce RTX 30 Series graphics cards, as well as Microsoft’s new flagship console, the Xbox Series X. Strangely, the bug doesn’t seem to affect the...

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[Paul_Johnson]

"HDMI 2.1 Receivers Can’t Pass 4K/120 Hz Content from NVIDIA GeForce RTX 30 Series GPUs and Xbox Series X Due to Major Chipset Feature"

Fixed that for you

 

[Armenius]

So Microsoft and NVIDIA are the only ones doing it right, since FRL supersedes TMDS in the new specification.

 

[LazyGamer]

This on top of LG not having universal codec support for their eARC implementation...

Home theater tech truly sucks.

 

[Peter_Brosdahl]

HT stuff has been hit and miss, and somewhat all over the map for decades. From DVD players that may or may not decode various audio streams, or have the ability to read different disc layers, to HDR's ongoing evolution, or HDMI cables that might not actually perform as rated, there's been stuff for awhile now. From different color depths to native vs. upscaled refresh rates, and now multiple VRR implementation types, there's a whole new swath of stuff to conisder with display tech as well. For those needing the most basic things it's usually not so much an issue but for the rest of us trying to use the high end features it can really be a headache in wrangling it all down to get working. I admit, though, this ongoing HDMI 2.1 stuff is a bit ridiculous. Hopefully it'll all get sorted out soon. It does make me glad I don't need to replace my Onkyo receivers yet but even then, one of them had to get a firmware update just to support DTS:X and Dolby Atmos a month or so after I got it.

 

[Burticus]

Wasn't aware there were any HDMI 2.1 AVRs yet.

My Yamaha is HDMI 2.0 I think, 4K certified but at what refresh who knows. About 3 years old. I had already figured I was going to have to bypass my AVR and go straight to TV from PS5, then run ARC back to the receiver I guess. The PS5 doesn't have an optical jack so I don't know how else to get audio back to the receiver.

Unless the 4K passthrough of the AVR wouldn't affect VRR and other things of the HDMI 2.1 nature. Hard to predict such things when they don't exist in the wild yet.

Eh but what do I know. I'm not an HDMI engineer.

edit - just looked it up and my Yamaha RX-A660 does 4k/60 passthrough and no e-arc. Boooo

 

[Zarathustra]

Whoops.

Not sure I'd want to play anything that way either way, as most receivers introduce a bunch of input lag.

I'd probably wire the GPU straight to the monitor, and do audio over a separate HDMI cable.

You'd lose the receiver overlays, but that is a small price to pay.

 

[Burticus]

Not sure I'd want to play anything that way either way, as most receivers introduce a bunch of input lag.

I'd probably wire the GPU straight to the monitor, and do audio over a separate HDMI cable.

You mean via ARC? Not like the PS5 has dual HDMI outputs. I haven't messed with ARC too much lately, last time I did was a friend's setup and it had wicked lipsync problems. Probably firmware or a setting somewhere, but I didn't have forever to work on his problem. He gave up on the AVR and went Sonus soundbar.

I've never noticed lag when gaming with my PS4 going through my Yamaha AVR @ 1080p. But then again I am not a competitive gamer.

 

[Zarathustra]

You mean via ARC? Not like the PS5 has dual HDMI outputs. I haven't messed with ARC too much lately, last time I did was a friend's setup and it had wicked lipsync problems. Probably firmware or a setting somewhere, but I didn't have forever to work on his problem. He gave up on the AVR and went Sonus soundbar.

I've never noticed lag when gaming with my PS4 going through my Yamaha AVR @ 1080p. But then again I am not a competitive gamer.

Ah, I wasn't thinking consoles when I read any of that.

I don't recall ever feeling lag on any console ever. I think controllers since they are so mcuh less sensitive shield you from the sensation of lag somewhat.

 

[LazyGamer]

I've never noticed lag when gaming with my PS4 going through my Yamaha AVR @ 1080p. But then again I am not a competitive gamer.

Have an older Yamaha myself, and I can get the viewport going one way while I'm slinging the mouse the other

TVs are already pretty hit or miss with input lag. The ability to clean up sources is certainly still in demand, so manufacturers have more to balance than on monitors, and understandably need to be careful about where they put the 'turn off all the processing' settings.

You almost want to have entirely separate paths for interactive (games) and non-interactive content, if you could only pull that off without sacrificing convenience. eARC is supposed to be that solution.

 

[Brian_B]

I have an older Yamaha, it has HDMI. I think it was among the first generation to have HDMI - as it also sports a bunch of S-Video, composite, and RCA inputs on the back.

I haven't actually used the HDMI inputs on it ... ever, I don't think. I do have an HDMI output run to the TV, just so I can use the setup menu on the receiver (it's an Atari 2600 level GUI), but once I run the auto-setup to calibrate speakers based on wherever my wife has decided to move the chairs that month, I don't really need it again. I really only use it as an amplifier, but that does mean all the HDMI inputs on my TV are taken up, and I'm running TOSLINK from the TV back to the receiver.

Less than optimal, but it's worked all these years so far, the amplifier still sounds great, and figure it will keep on working until I finally decide to upgrade to Atmos or something beyond 5.1.

I admit I was looking at one of these HDMI 2.1 receivers not too long ago, as I just recently re-ran rear speaker wire and was looking at adding Atmos at the same time - but very glad I held off on that.

 

[Peter_Brosdahl]

Whoops.

Not sure I'd want to play anything that way either way, as most receivers introduce a bunch of input lag.

I'd probably wire the GPU straight to the monitor, and do audio over a separate HDMI cable.

You'd lose the receiver overlays, but that is a small price to pay.

That's another reason I like Strix cards. Usually have at least 2 DP and 2 HDMI

 

[Uvilla]

I have an older Yamaha, it has HDMI. I think it was among the first generation to have HDMI - as it also sports a bunch of S-Video, composite, and RCA inputs on the back.

I haven't actually used the HDMI inputs on it ... ever, I don't think. I do have an HDMI output run to the TV, just so I can use the setup menu on the receiver (it's an Atari 2600 level GUI), but once I run the auto-setup to calibrate speakers based on wherever my wife has decided to move the chairs that month, I don't really need it again. I really only use it as an amplifier, but that does mean all the HDMI inputs on my TV are taken up, and I'm running TOSLINK from the TV back to the receiver.

Less than optimal, but it's worked all these years so far, the amplifier still sounds great, and figure it will keep on working until I finally decide to upgrade to Atmos or something beyond 5.1.

I admit I was looking at one of these HDMI 2.1 receivers not too long ago, as I just recently re-ran rear speaker wire and was looking at adding Atmos at the same time - but very glad I held off on that.

Thats a lot like what I had but the amplifier died at some point, so i have nothing right now. However always thought I would go all HDMI next round... I don't know. The whole home theater stuff is a mess, unless I suppose if you sink a lot of money.

 

[Zarathustra]

I have an older Yamaha, it has HDMI. I think it was among the first generation to have HDMI - as it also sports a bunch of S-Video, composite, and RCA inputs on the back.

I haven't actually used the HDMI inputs on it ... ever, I don't think. I do have an HDMI output run to the TV, just so I can use the setup menu on the receiver (it's an Atari 2600 level GUI), but once I run the auto-setup to calibrate speakers based on wherever my wife has decided to move the chairs that month, I don't really need it again. I really only use it as an amplifier, but that does mean all the HDMI inputs on my TV are taken up, and I'm running TOSLINK from the TV back to the receiver.

Less than optimal, but it's worked all these years so far, the amplifier still sounds great, and figure it will keep on working until I finally decide to upgrade to Atmos or something beyond 5.1.

I admit I was looking at one of these HDMI 2.1 receivers not too long ago, as I just recently re-ran rear speaker wire and was looking at adding Atmos at the same time - but very glad I held off on that.

Optical connections are great, but they can run out of bandwidth for anything above 2 channel audio.

 

[Peter_Brosdahl]

Optical connections are great, but they can run out of bandwidth for anything above 2 channel audio.

I was surprised a while back when one of my motherboards(don't remember which) actually let me do 5.1 24/96 to a receiver. It was so awesome because, at the time, the graphics card I had only had 1 HDMI. It was a long time ago. Most of the time, though, I've been limited to 2.0 24/96. Glad those days are over but they were fun for awhile.

 

[Zarathustra]

I was surprised a while back when one of my motherboards(don't remember which) actually let me do 5.1 24/96 to a receiver. It was so awesome because, at the time, the graphics card I had only had 1 HDMI. It was a long time ago. Most of the time, though, I've been limited to 2.0 24/96. Glad those days are over but they were fun for awhile.

My understanding is that if the audio is AC3 or DTS encoded you can usually squeeze in more, and maybe the sound chipset on that motherboard was encoding it? I don't know if such a thing exists. I'd imagine it might introduce processing lag though.

 

[Armenius]

I was surprised a while back when one of my motherboards(don't remember which) actually let me do 5.1 24/96 to a receiver. It was so awesome because, at the time, the graphics card I had only had 1 HDMI. It was a long time ago. Most of the time, though, I've been limited to 2.0 24/96. Glad those days are over but they were fun for awhile.

Bitstream encoding allows 5.1 audio over TOSLINK. I was doing it for more than a decade.

 

[Peter_Brosdahl]

My understanding is that if the audio is AC3 or DTS encoded you can usually squeeze in more, and maybe the sound chipset on that motherboard was encoding it? I don't know if such a thing exists. I'd imagine it might introduce processing lag though.

Yep I saw that and was able to allow pass through but I was also surprised when Windows let me select 5.1 in sound settings. A lot of the time it only gave a stereo option for other rigs.

 

[Burticus]

I have an older Yamaha, it has HDMI. I think it was among the first generation to have HDMI - as it also sports a bunch of S-Video, composite, and RCA inputs on the back.

I haven't actually used the HDMI inputs on it ... ever, I don't think. I do have an HDMI output run to the TV, just so I can use the setup menu on the receiver (it's an Atari 2600 level GUI), but once I run the auto-setup to calibrate speakers based on wherever my wife has decided to move the chairs that month, I don't really need it again. I really only use it as an amplifier, but that does mean all the HDMI inputs on my TV are taken up, and I'm running TOSLINK from the TV back to the receiver.

Less than optimal, but it's worked all these years so far, the amplifier still sounds great, and figure it will keep on working until I finally decide to upgrade to Atmos or something beyond 5.1.

I admit I was looking at one of these HDMI 2.1 receivers not too long ago, as I just recently re-ran rear speaker wire and was looking at adding Atmos at the same time - but very glad I held off on that.

Someone is going to be in for a fun time with the new consoles, neither of which have toslink anymore. Everything going HDMI has been a benefit and a curse. It makes wiring so much easier, but you are left with limitations.

I have a 1999 era Yamaha in my office. Toslink is as good as that one gets. Otherwise it's just as good sounding an amp as the 2016 model in my living room.

My living room AVR doesn't do EARC, that is supposed to be a HDMI 2.1 thing. It will support ARC I just have never tried it. I guess I will be doing that if I get a new TV and PS5 for Xmas.

 

[LazyGamer]

My understanding is that if the audio is AC3 or DTS encoded you can usually squeeze in more, and maybe the sound chipset on that motherboard was encoding it? I don't know if such a thing exists. I'd imagine it might introduce processing lag though.

It's all software, and since it has to be decoded by the receiver, there can be processing lag there too, on top of those codecs all being lossy (and ancient).

I'll say that it's not a bad way to do things if the latency doesn't impact what you're doing, it's just almost completely obsoleted with HDMI.